Ouch! Now come the articles suggesting that Carl Calleman’s manner of assessing the end time of the Mayan calendar is “idiosyncratic” and inaccurate. I personally have no idea who may be right and who may be wrong. Reader discretion is required.
Note: Whatever the truth of the matter, I don’t support the attitude of attack in the second article by Mark Heley. I don’t believe there’s any need to assume that posture.
Note as well: AA Michael’s statement that some people may ascend on Oct. 28 was not based on the date being the end of the Mayan Calendar. The comment which he actually made about Nov. 11 I think applies to Oct. 28 as well: “It has captured and started to build energy in the human community. … And we are cooperating fully so everything is in alignment.” (Reading with AA Michael, Sept. 17, 2011.)
Some people have questioned my motives in publishing these two articles. On the matter of my motives, please see “Allegations that I Work for the Dark” at http://goldenageofgaia.com/2011/10/allegations-that-i-work-for-the-dark/#more-75746
Thanks to Marcus.
Oct 28, 2011 Is The End of The Calleman Calendar,
Not The End of The Mayan Calendar
~ By Serena RedFeather ~
The Ancient Maya are widely recognized as the most precise, sophisticated, accurate Timekeepers the Planet has ever known. The Mystery of the Mayan Time Science is vast. Much has been lost throughout the past hundreds of years, resulting from the attempted annihilation of the Maya calendars, books, artifacts and temples in 1572 by Bishop De Landa of the Roman Vatican.
This massive genocide of cultural wisdom left only 3 Mayan codices intact, tiny links to their once immense records of 17 calendars that mapped the Universe’s cycles, linking microcosm to macrocosm. As is known by many, after the demise of the “Classic Maya Era,” the Maya peoples themselves also stopped tracking many of these calendars, including stopping following their “Long Count” calendar around 1100 AD, which was an important cycle which tracked the count of time constituting World Age Eras.
Therefore, what is left to those of us in these times who look to the Ancient Maya Timekeepers and Mayan Prophecies for guidance and understanding of these current moments, falls upon archeological decodings of ancient stone carvings, the threads of knowledge held and shared by living Maya Daykeeper Priests, and the “revelations” of modern messengers who have delved into Mayan time science and prophecy to unravel its significance.
Unfortunately, these 3 elements do not bear a unified whole, nor a tapestry of agreement we can look to and trust for holistic accuracy, as together they bring much contradiction and confusion – a reflection of these challenging and confounding times we live within, ripe with fragmented facts, projections, and distorted information. One is left to research and discern for oneself what the ancient Maya calendars and prophecies have to say to us now, and how to bridge the wisdom of the past into insight for now, and for our shared unfolding future.
As for the living Maya, there are contradictory voices in the forefront. The spokesman for 440 Maya tribes of Guatemala, Don Alejandro Cirilo Perez Oxlaj, a 13th Generation Quiche Maya Priest, points to the unfathomable desecration of the ancient Mayan records in 1572 as the cause of their not knowing when the cycle of this World Age ends. He has said that the signs are clearly everywhere that the shift of World Ages is near, but that they cannot with certainty say what day this will be.
Conversely, another prominent Maya messenger, Carlos Barrios who was trained over 25-years as a Mayan Ajq’ij (Priest) interviewed over 600 living Maya Daykeepers and has become one of the most vocal representatives assuring us that December 21, 2012 is indeed the transition date from the Fourth World Age, into the Fifth World Age, marking the precise entrance into a new era on Planet Earth, bringing a new alignment in human consciousness and new themes to govern our cultural manifestations.
As for archeological decodings of ancient stone monuments, at this time there is only one known of stela that speaks of the end of this 13-Baktun Long Count (5,125 year cycle), and it is conclusively correlated to December 21, 2012; 4 Ahau on the Tzolkin sacred calendar. This is Tortuguero Monument 6 from Tabasco Mexico, carved in late 7th century AD in the height of the Classic Maya Era. This Long Count Cycle is one of the 17 calendars of the ancient Maya Calendar Matrix, tracking this World Age that began on August 11, 3114 BC, also on 4 Ahau on the Sacred Tzolkin Calendar.
This Long Count cycle is a precise count of 1,872,000 days and archeological decodings verify that the same day-count recorded on ancient stones is still in use by the living Maya of Guatemala today. In other words, Tortuguero Monument 6 correlates 184.108.40.206.0 (the final day of the Long Count) as December 21, 2012, as 4 Ahau on the Tzolkin, which it will be to all the living Maya Daykeepers – 4 Ahau on their sacred calendar on Winter Solstice day 2012.
The fact of a vast cycle beginning on 4 Ahau, and completing over 5,000 years later also on 4 Ahau is deeply consistent with Maya cosmology – signifying a return, a reunion point of beginning and ending, like an ouroboros – a snake eating its own tail. For the record, there are many stelae confirming the beginning of the 13-Baktun Long Count as 4 Ahau, also indicated as 220.127.116.11.0. correlated to August 11, 3114 BC.
It is true and documented that Tortuguero Monument is cracked, missing pieces, and partially eroded in the places where it originally stated what will happen on this day or what the precise message is for us of how to relate to December 21, 2012, the completion of this World Age. So once again, the mystery is put directly into our living hands and wondering hearts. What small bit that has been deciphered from this stela is that on this date “Bolon Yokte Kuh” will be witnessed as it displays its full regalia. Through translation, this is understood as a 9-headed deity or 9-leveled entity, a cosmological reference point left as a clue for us from 1300 years ago in the past.
Enter in the pioneering researchers who have attempted to personally determine and reveal to the world the intentions and significance of the lost and fragmented Mayan time science and prophecies. Beyond archeological Mayanists, some of the more noteworthy independent researchers that have attempted to bridge science and spirit to give us a meaning to relate to these ancient clues include (but are not limited to): John Major Jenkins, Jose Arguelles, Geoff Stray, and Carl Calleman. Each of these men has devoted decades of their lives to unraveling these mysteries and shedding light for our struggling modern humanity to align ourselves with the prophetic callings of the ancient Maya.
These messengers are to be respected for their hard work, dedication, and courage to delve into a puzzle with many, many missing pieces. Each of these messengers, among others, have attempted to integrate archeological facts, with the wisdom lineages of the living Maya, along with their own revelatory decodings of this grand mystery, knowing from inside themselves the supreme relevance these ancient Mayan clues have for us now, in these unprecedented crossroads times on Planet Earth.
That being said, it is with utmost importance that it must also be stated that it is not wise for us to rely on any one messenger, be they of Mayan blood of not, to tell us the entire truth of these ancient calendars and the significance their prophecies hold for our lives. Here, now, we are being called upon to discern for ourselves, doing our best to comprehend facts, and also to apply our deepest intuitive faculties in the face of this living enigma.
In this personal discernment process, it is relevant that, with the exception of Calleman’s work, most all other most prominent messengers are aligned that December 21, 2012, as stated in ancient stone, is conclusively the end of this current World Age, leading us inevitably into a new cycle. This fact of a transition from one world age to the next is consistent with prophecies and teachings from many peoples – the Hopi, Cherokee, the Inuit, Q’ero of Peru, Maori of New Zealand, Dogons of Africa, Aborigines of Australia, to name but a few.
In regards to the now infamous date of 12/21/12, the dominant understanding is that this date does NOT mark the end of the world, but rather signifies the end of this world age, a critical distinction. Don Alejandro affirms that the living Maya have never associated their prophecies with the “end of the world” and he expressed loud dismay with the unnecessary fear generated by the distortion of the Mayan prophecies. Indeed, there are a range of projections of “what will happen” on Solstice 2012, and how the transformation of worlds will unfold after this gateway date. Surely this puts the responsibility back on us to surrender to, consciously participate in, and rise to this occasion of World Age Shifting. So the mystery of our shared journey naturally continues.
As a messenger that has been labeled a “Mayan Calendar Expert,” Swedish biologist Carl Calleman has asserted a voice alone in the Mayan field: that “the end date of the Mayan Calendar is October 28, 2011.” His work has been criticized by many, as its foundation is not substantiated by anything other than his own revelatory findings. Many who are not versed in the history and nuances of Mayan time science have subscribed to his assertation of Oct 28, 2011 being the end of the Mayan Calendar.
To clarify, it is misleading to refer to “the end of the Mayan Calendar.” Again, the Ancient Maya had 17 calendars. Their central sacred calendar of 260-day cycles, known as the “Tzolkin,” correlated all of their 17 calendars, and is an unbroken count of days, still in use by the Maya of of today. October 25, 2011 is 10 N’oj on their Tzolkin count. If you ask any living Maya they will assure you there is no end to the Tzolkin – that is a crude distortion of their cosmology embodied and expressed in their sacred calendar, comparable to saying there is an end to creation itself – for that is what their calendar marks – the pulses of movement and measure mapping Nature’s creative principles. However, of the 17 calendars, as Carlos Barrios confirmed, the end of the 13-Baktun Long Count Calendar Cycle is recognized as December 21, 2012, marking the end of this World Age Cycle.
Calleman has put forth a unique calendrical map which he has called “Mayan,” but when publicly questioned has clarified it is largely a product of his revelation, therefore not an authentic ancient Mayan map. This is a very important, largely overlooked point. There is nothing wrong with revelation, and in fact it plays a very important role in counter-balancing the presence of traditions.
However, as a messenger to the world, it is essential one responsibly clarify the source of one’s information, and exactly what one is representing. This integrity is necessary that one’s audience is informed, and empowered to decide for themselves if they resonate with someone’s revelation, comprehending it as a modern interpretation and adaptation of ancient science, rather than an intact rendition.
While Calleman may have alluded to “Maya Elders” endorsing his viewpoints or participating in his calendrical celebrations, there has been no clear public announcements from any known reputable daykeepers that have endorsed his end-date, nor his larger counting system. And even so, simply having “Maya Elders” affirm one’s revelations still does not assure their accuracy, as again, this living mystery calls out OUR higher discernment, and is not to simply take some “authority’s” word for it.
Calleman’s system involves 9 Waves, and is said to map the beginning of the vast cycle of the evolution of the “Divine Plan” that began with the Big Bang 16 billion years ago – apparently aligned with an exact date that he has calculated. Based on its internal mathematical scheme, correlated to a simple progression of Mayan mathematics, the Calleman calendar system therefore ends on October 28, 2011, 13 Ahau on the Tzolkin. For the record, there is no other researcher that has formulated these dates, nor this system, yet it has managed to pollinate itself widely as “The Mayan Calendar,” complete with a modern, self-selected end-date, seemingly fabricated solely as the logical mathematical conclusion of his larger framework devised via his personal revelations.
While Calleman frequently refers to Tortuguero Monument 6 as validating his system of 9 waves because the 9-headed deity is said to display itself at the completion of the cycle, he has blatantly disregarded the archeological proof that Tortuguero clearly correlates the end of the 13-Baktun count as December 21, 2012, a date 420 days later than Oct 28, 2011. It must be asked: It is sound logic or science to integrate what fits your case while simultaneously disregarding the glaring evidence which invalidates your case? Is that omitting of an essential fact not a distortion that could mislead the audience that one is responsible for educating?
Calleman is adamant that the vast cycle of creation has to end on 13 Ahau on the Tzolkin, and cannot end on 4 Ahau, one of his main arguments for his self-selected end-date. Again, this is a personal interpretation of his perspectives on Mayan calendrics, and is blatantly disregarding the authority of what the ancient messengers carved in stone when they mapped that the beginning, and ending, of this World Age is 4 Ahau on their sacred calendar. As a lesser point, Calleman’s logic is that (according to the Yucatec Maya count) 13 Ahau is the 260th day of the 260-day cycle, therefore must be the end-date. However, let us not overlook that the living Quiche Maya of Guatemala do not track the Tzolkin in this Yucatec way – rather they start their Tzolkin on 8 Batz (not 1 Imix), therefore to them, 13 Ahau is NOT the final day of the Tzolkin.
Unfortunately, there has been much polarity and confusion put out by Calleman that December 21, 2012 is only a “pop end-date.” This line of thinking is disrespectful to the archeological evidence; to the Tortuguero Monument itself and the authentic Maya messengers who carved it; to the living Maya who affirm Solstice 2012 as the completion of this World Age; and to the findings of the other independent researchers who also affirm their educated allegiance to this highly substantiated date of 12/21/12.
Calleman’s most recent message from Oct 6, 2011 is what inspired the writing of this paper. Below are included direct quotes from his most recent blog post, and commentary for your consideration.
Carl Calleman writes: “What will the end of the Mayan calendar on October 28, 2011 mean?
…As October 28, 2011 is now coming close the definition of this “end” is something that may be important to clarify. The contemporary Maya no longer follow the long cycles of the ancient calendar system and so do not want to take a stand in the matter.”
That is a misleading generalization to state the Maya do not wish to take a stand in the matter, and is not accurately representing the whole of Maya daykeepers.
Carl Calleman writes:
“One can also say with some certainty that time as we have experienced it up until now as directed (the so called arrow of time) is likely to come to an end as the Mayan calendar does. This is because up until October 28, 2011 the evolution of our planet and the universe has been driven by nine different waves developing phenomena in a directed manner from seed to mature fruit… What is coming to its fullness are the nine levels of evolution, the nine directed waves that have created the universe on the largest scale. At least regarding its level of consciousness the evolution of the universe will then have been completed and it will then have attained its highest quantum state…”
How can one say that as of one day in the Universe, based on a map made of his own mind, that the evolution of the universe will have been completed and will have attained its highest quantum state? This does make any sense whatsoever and is preposterous at best. The Universe is a living beingness, there is no linear endpoint to its evolution, nor our evolution, nor a highest state to attain. Surely however life appears in 4 days from now on Oct 28, 2011 will not be the be-all, end-all highest potential of the Universe. How can any thinking person possibly subscribe to this? This statement renders Calleman’s entire body of work highly questionable.
Carl Calleman writes:
“There are however still some open questions as to how this attainment of the highest level of consciousness would apply to our experience of time and what calendar, if any, to follow after October 28, 2011. Will for instance the various tzolkin energies continue to influence our personal lives? Will the nine waves continue indefinitely with their current frequencies or will they stop? At closer thought it is probably unlikely that the tzolkin would continue if the waves stop, since the tzolkin is essentially a temporal microcosm of the waves. On the other hand if the waves continue the same would most likely be true for the tzolkin as it represents a microcosm of these waves. If the waves, and especially the ninth wave, continue after October 28, 2011 we should however be aware that this would not mean that evolution continues. Evolution is a phenomenon of both a biological and cultural nature that is generated as the universe has climbed to higher and higher levels of consciousness and through processes in thirteen steps from seed to mature fruit. Because on October 28, 2011 the universe attains its highest quantum state there will however be no higher state to evolve to.”
It is fascinating the Calleman himself is vacillating over how the 9 Wave theory actually plays out for the world. If one reads previous writings from him, the message is not always consistent, and clearly he is not even sure of how his own system works, even though he is adamant it is a map of “The Divine Plan of Creation.”
For the record, here is the definition of ev·o·lu·tion:
“1.any process of formation or growth; development: the evolution of a language; the evolution of the airplane. 2. a product of such development; something evolved:The exploration of space is the evolution of decades of research. 3.Biology. change in the gene pool of a population from generation to generation by such processes as mutation, natural selection, and genetic drift.
4.a process of gradual, peaceful, progressive change or development, as in social or economic structure or institutions.”
To say that as of Oct 28, 2011 there will be no higher state to evolve to is the most unscientific, irrational, unfounded, linear, bizarre statement imaginable. What type of Universe is this model describing? Surely not one that models Mayan cosmology. Surely not one that is aligned with the prophecies of peoples the world over who speak of the ongoing mental and spiritual evolution of our human race. One example alone from the Q’ero Elders of Peru speaks of the evolution of our species of Homo Sapiens into a new species they call Homo Luminous. While this sounds like a New Age concept, it is actually an ancient prophecy that is aligned with many other traditions that speak of the mutation of who we are now into a new humanity, capable of generating new forms of culture to incarnate a new era on this Earth.
Not to mention the fact that the Universe lives and expresses itself through human beings, and therefore in all the tiny acts of our own learning and growing and expanding our capacities, we are the Universe evolving, on and on and on… Why should – and how could – there be an end to evolution? This almost hints at an overly literal interpretation of his calendar map, for example, exhibiting the same kind of distorted thinking that those who literally interpret the Bible come to.
Carl Calleman writes:
“Rather if indeed the waves continue indefinitely this would be experienced more like a grinding process of the world and the human beings. This would go on until the unity consciousness of the Ninth wave has finally been established and all phenomena inconsistent with this weeded out. I do not think it is possible to judge yet if the waves will come to an end or not even if I am increasingly inclined to believe that they will continue indefinitely. Linked to this uncertainty is the question what calendars would be most meaningful to follow after October 28, 2011… it still remains to be seen what calendar, if any, it will be meaningful to follow after October 28, 2011.”
So is it about Oct 28, 2011 or is it open ended?
This whole statement is a Calleman viewpoint, and should not be associated as representing anything pertaining to Mayan Calendars, as there are no Mayan Calendars that end on October 28, 2011, therefore this question has no relevance to those of us who comprehend the authentic Mayan Calendar cycles. With respect to the living Maya and their living Tzolkin calendar, Calleman is out of line as someone supposedly representing Mayan time science to state he does not know what calendars will be meaningful to follow after his concocted evolutionary rapture date that is about to pass – probably already over after most people have even read this commentary.
One more time, let it be clarified: The 13-Baktun Mayan Long Count Cycle ends on December 21,2012, completing this World Age, and signalling a gateway to a new World Age, bringing ever new waves of evolution and transformation, along with new levels of awareness and new challenges to catalyze new growth. The 260-day Mayan Tzolkin calendar continues indefinitely.
With all due respect to the gifts and wisdom he may embody, Carl Calleman is not an expert nor a leader that should be looked to to determine what calendars the world should follow, nor how we should track and relate to World Ages Cycles…
In short, these important times on Earth are calling us to question authority…to research and think for ourselves, and to discern and find our true resonance, that we may walk upon our most empowered path amidst these chaotic moments of great acceleration and information overload.
May everyone who seeks for truth find it inside of themselves. And may the authentic messages and ancient meanings encoded into the Mayan Prophecy of 2012 shed a new light to illuminate our collective journey on Planet Earth, day by day by day…
Panche Be ~ “Seeking the Root of Truth in Order to Know and Understand”
Written on Oct 25, 2011 ~ 10 N’oj
For extensive information on Tortuguero Monument 6 visit: http://www.wayeb.org/notes/wayeb_notes0034.pdf
Calleman’s Pyramid Scheme
Posted: October 26th, 2011
You may have heard that the ‘end date’ of the ‘Mayan calendar’ is actually going to be this Friday, October 28th, 2011, rather than December 21st 2012. This idea is based on the idiosyncratic work of Dr. Carl Calleman. This theory is ‘idiosyncratic’ in that it bears no relationship whatsoever to any other Mayan scholarship, or indigenous Mayan teaching.
The origin of the idea is proposed in Dr. Calleman’s book ‘The Mayan Calendar: Solving the greatest mystery of all time’. Its basis is that cycles of time in the Mayan calendar could be represented in physical form by the sacred architecture of the pyramids.
Taking inspiration from the Aztec and Nahtual sources, Calleman then links the cycle of thirteen periods in the calendar to thirteen deities of the Thirteen Heavens. (These are the gods traditionally associated with each of these numbers by the Aztecs.) All of this is highly speculative. Johan Nomark, an academic Swedish student of the Maya calendars, has described this mish-mash of Nahtual and Aztec gods and Mayan calendrics as “one great stew of nonsense”.
Calleman then further developed this theory into a grand 9-level “pyramid of time” based on a Mayan ‘stele’ inscription found at the site of Coba. The carving on this monument records a huge number of time cycles, all of which are numbered as thirteen. It goes way beyond the thirteen baktun count of 5,125 years, to include numbers that are hundreds of millions of times bigger than the known age of the universe! While most Mayan scholars see this monument as being mythic and metaphorical, alluding to the idea that there are infinite cycles of time, Calleman speculates it represents a temporal scale with increasing stages of acceleration.
Calleman’s model uses just the nine time cycles within this inscription that have been given names. The total time-span of these adds up to 16.4 billion years. This is approximately the current age of the universe, according to the “big bang” theory. (Most estimates suggest this happened about 13.7 billion years ago.) This, he suggests, means that the Maya actually knew about the big bang and that the monument is recording this.
This, unfortunately, ignores the fact that the names the cycles have been given are not actually from the Maya, but are instead arbitrary conventions suggested by modern academics. Calleman just leaves out the bigger cycles on the monument. The Coba stele is just one inscription among thousands and Calleman’s theory ignores most of it. The calendar is further ‘shoe horned’ into his Pyramid scheme when the final cycle of the ‘nine levels’ doesn’t fit into any actual Mayan calendrical cycle. In a desperate attempt to make his hypothesis work, Calleman has now changed the length of this cycle from the one he originally calculated in his own theory.
Another problem for Calleman’s nine-level pyramid as a description of the evolution of consciousness is that the idea that the ‘Bolontiku’, or nine gods, represent multi-leveled underworlds, is an early invention of “Colonial period writers” and has long been discredited. These gods are (unfortunately for Calleman) deities of war and chaos, rather than evolution and consciousness.
The notion that the calendar must end on the tzolkin sign 13 Ahau is another fundamental mistake. Ending and beginning points in the 260-day circular tzolkin count are arbitrary and variable. For example, the indigenous Quiche Maya begin their count on 8 ‘Batz’, or Monkey, whereas the convention of beginning on 1 Imix and ending on 13 Ahau is taken from the “Buk Xoc” permutational table written on the inside front cover of The Book Of Chilam Balam of Mani. 360-day Tun ending dates and their higher multiples are actually what is important in the Long Count notation, not Tzolkin dates..
Calleman’s theory is essentially a crude pastiche and imitation of Mayan calendrics that no academic Mayanist would entertain for a moment as having any validity whatsoever. Possibly the most significant point is that if Calleman were right, it would mean quite simply that ALL Mayan inscriptions of the Classic period were wrong, as no-one other than him has ever questioned the correlation of Tzolkin dates with those of the Long Count. This is mostly because it is totally absurd to do so, because they form parts of one integrated system.
Calleman’s theories have no greater merit in Mayanology than those of Harold Camping in Theology. Supporters of his theory say that Calleman has made successful predictions using it, but, for example, his financial crash prediction for 7/11/2009 failed.
More importantly Calleman is obscuring the facts of the discovery of the 21/12/2012 end-date of the Thirteen Baktun Count. This is one of the greatest intellectual achievements of the twentieth century. Accurately deciphering this date involved the life works of many of the greatest Mayan scholars, such as Eric Thompson and Tatiana Proskouriakoff. The “GMT” correlation of 21/12/2012 has been tested against many real-world astronomical events mentioned in Mayan texts and inscriptions and the overwhelming consensus of Mayan scholars agree with it. This correlation is in no way tied to the Gregorian calendar. (This, incidentally, also disproves another Internet-driven myth about the Mayan calendar’s end-date being a ‘year out’ because of the missing Gregorian year of 0 AD.)
Why are Dr. Calleman and so many of his followers promoting these ‘theories’ when they are so easily disproved by even a small amount of research? This is a good question. Dr. Calleman cut his teeth on being a critic of Dr. Jose Arguelles, another modern-day interpreter of the Mayan calendar. After making great capital out of dismissing Arguelles’ work as being a distortion from the original Mayan system, Calleman went on to create his own fantasy system that did exactly the same! In a world of sound-bites, tweets and status updates, “instant wisdom” that is delivered in bite-sized chunks panders to the conformation biases we all have in our social worldviews.
Too few people check the information they share. Hence the viral spread of nonsense about non-events like Comet Elenin is greater than ever before. Calleman has prospered by criticizing the ideas of others, while those he is promoting have managed to avoid serious scrutiny. This is because they are simply absurd to serious Mayan scholars, while being easily consumable by those searching for easy answers without having to do any intellectual heavy lifting.
On Friday, exactly 420 days before the real end of the Thirteen Baktun cycle, Calleman’s pyramid scheme will be consigned to the dustbin of failed eschatologies. Don’t expect any hubris from Dr. Calleman though; peddlers of the failed world endings, tend to adjust their dates, rather then their assumptions.
What is unfortunate is that the real significance of the 21/12/2012 date is getting lost in the signal-to-noise ratio surrounding the ‘2012’ meme. We are indeed living on the cusp of the ending of a 5,125-year cycle. One thing is certain, it is going to come down to WHAT WE ACTUALLY CHOOSE TO DO that matters in manifesting any shift in planetary consciousness around this point, rather than the speculations and predictions of armchair theorists.
Mark Heley, author ‘The Everything Guide to 2012’
Geoff Stray Shows Calleman’s Calendar Wrong, http://bit.ly/scxCP9
How to spot a Maya prophet’s hoax http://bit.ly/tUtGyZ
Carl Calleman’s Long Count End Date Proved Wrong http://bit.ly/v91tIV